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Now sixteen sounds about okay to me if youre going to stick a limit somewhere, but then being British I suppose Im more likely to think the system Im accustomed to is normal and reasonable. Not to say it was nice.. Video, 00:02:30. They did not pay for them and were going to kill a lot of them anyway. There is the Push argument and the Pull argument. He was born in Nigeria but arrived in the . But that is not the argument I am making. One in which enslaved people suffered and even died from malnutrition, as the economics of the slave trade meant that it was cheaper, at times, to starve people and then replace them than it was to provide them with food. The stars are out as Dr Pete Olusoga explores the psychology of stage and screen with the wonderful British actor (and Coronation Street veteran), Shobna Gulati. It happened. You can pay all the reparation for historical slavery related wrongs, real or imaginary, you want. Good point, I wonder how he squares the obviously comfortable living he has writing, opining and broadcasting about slavery with his principles. By David Dabydeen (Photo By Alamy) Nineteen eighty-four was a transformative year for David Olusoga. Those who grew rich on slavery and the slave trade were not neutral and no achievement or act of philanthropy justifies airbrushing their involvement from history.. Those aged 11-14 have to be taught about the British Empire between 1745-1901, however the slave trade is one of nine examples given by the Department of Education on what can be taught. Prof Darity and Ms Mullen outline that to eliminate the existing Black-White wealth gap an allocation of between $10 trillion and $12 trillion, or about $800,000 per black household, should be paid. Had a vault for the more inflammatory pieces. Hes welcome to pursue his line of thought but he should bear in mind that tolerance is, by its nature, in the gift of the powerful. There is no reason to single White people out for unique levels of criticism. Its been banned for two centuries in Britain. So wherever the wealth came from, it wasnt just slavery (or even mainly), Olusogas an alright presenter but a class A race hustler, Edward Lud August 30, 2020 at 9:12 am We could just cut to the chase, and impose a reparations tax on anyone who is descended from from anyone who did something, er, wrong.. No member of my family ever owned slaves. Its extraordinary success rested upon the foundation of sympathy laid down during the previous 70 years of abolitionist activity in Britain. The South Sea bubble, the greatest financial crash of the 18th century, was intimately connected to Britains dealings with Africa, though this is rarely acknowledged by historians. "They're not looking to history only to make them feel good and give them comfort, but they're looking to history to tell them things about truths about their society that we have traditionally edited out of British history.". We do not know for sure. (As the first person to mention the Sokoto Caliphate ahh, forget it.). As Black British History Month draws to a close, TV historian Prof David Olusoga looks at the impact it's had - and how young people are taking it on. If someone from Portugal or France wants to explain why their country has done a better job of getting the balance right, Im open to hearing it. The agreement is being touted as a . In America few were castrated, which is why there are now >40 million descendants there. The people in Portland, Seattle and Kenosha are too decadent to fight back. Ive always agreed that the Africans should pay reparations to the rest of us for dumping all those people they wanted to get rid of on us. David Olusoga, introduces his book Black and British, an exploration of the relationship between the British Isles and the people of Africa. Sloane witnessed and later became part of a system ruled by terror. That is not true. It is a good deed that must not go unpunished. Guess wed have to print it. Cheap ass presentism. Well whats the point of pretending it doesnt also induce moral disgust in me, just in case someone mistakes it for guilt, or an admission of liability? Just means they werent alone in being in the wrong. Would probably have taken your suggestion as a challenge. Reckon they found commenters guessing which parts of a hypothetical argument were meant all part of the fun, In many respects youre one of the posters here whose views on morality Im closest to our personal moralities probably being quite far apart, but I recognise mine as very much the product of my upbringing and surrounding society and know enough about other places and times to realise just how contingent that makes them. They included Josiah Wedgwood (the pottery entrepreneur), Granville Sharp and Thomas Clarkson. Nineteen eighty-four affected him in another way: the publication of Peter Fryers groundbreaking Staying Power: The History of Black People in Britain introduced him to the scholarship needed to understand his position in Britain. From Roots. Exactly, bis. If more African-Americans started to vote Republican and the Democrats felt they needed something radical to boost their offer, and had enough support from liberal whites and other groups to risk further losses among blue-collar whites, for example. It may not. I assume he is not very bright and Race Hustling is very lucrative. at scales that were unusual in the long and varied history of slavery, and levels of brutality that stood out too.. In 1861, the Economist stated that nearly four million people in Britain depended directly and indirectly on the cotton industry; a fifth of the entire population. I assume these were usually killed before Europeans turned up and bought them. Mans a loon. I can then give him the details of other descendants, he can apologise to and compensate. Although I would expect the Germans, and perhaps even the Japanese, to be happy they lost the war. Olusoga patterns his narrative after Fryers, starting with the North African presence in Roman Britain. It seems absurd to me that anyone should be concerned about what happened 200 or 500 years ago. I agree BIS. But werent they lucky compared to the other Germans in Stalingrad? The system he witnessed and wrote about was one in which human beings were worked to death. Why are these characterizations needed? "The way history is viewed is changing. That was when the Democrats were still Americans. is that the extra demand distorted the market, led directly to more armed slave-raiding expeditions against rival tribes and so on.. Not sure how sick this makes me. Would the good professor really be so different if genealogical records could prove he had African ancestors who owned African slaves? "This generation has the greatest knowledge-giving tool ever created and they have access to knowledge that I just did not have when I was younger. Quite possibly slave-raiding Gaels before that. And the Domesday Book even counts slaves as a separate category below the unfree peasants (villans, bordars and cottars) those owed service to a Lord who could order them to move about and could say yes or no to their proposed marriages, but unlike slaves he didnt own them, couldnt sell them, and they had property rights to at least a smallholding. Ironically, one of the sources we can turn to in order to learn more is his own accounts of late 17th-century Jamaica. Video, 00:02:30Should black history be taught all year round? * the legal institution and pretty much the practice During the Second World War, thousands of black American soldiers stationed in Britain were befriended by white Britons who opposed efforts by the white military to segregate them. The good news is that Black Lives Matter may be that trigger. They did not care much for adult males. Cotton was a completely different slave economy. I have that estimate saved and ready to be critiqued as part of a larger project. Pope Nicholas V gave his blessing, so long as the Vatican benefited. He also studied at the University of Liverpool and so benefits from slavery as much as anyone else. It isnt happening now. Theres a flaw in arguments of the form frankly you should be glad I murdered your sister, since had I not done so, its quite possible though we cannot be sure that someone else would have tortured her then murdered her, which is even worse, so whos the real criminal? Which is that I still murdered your sister. Watching @worstall execute @richardjmurphy is like watching a very, very clever cat slowly killing at ataxic mouse. Perhaps Im a bit more culturally relativist these days, but just read it again, still absolutely awful. Not to say it was nice. If black lives really mattered these people would be protesting the 500 shot dead so far by predominantly black men in Chicago this year. My first reaction, years and years ago, was thats awful. Olusoga is just getting even because he was attacked by the right when he was a teenager. Olusoga, who is half-Nigerian, traces this focus to his mother telling him when he was a child that Nigerian soldiers served in World War II. Dr Peter Olusoga is a senior psychology lecturer at Sheffield Hallam university. "They do not want British history to be a catalogue of heroes and victories and glorious chapters," he says. Their demands should simply be refused. A House Through Time returned to BBC Two in May for its third season, and once again is fronted by historian extraordinaire David Olusoga. I could just as well feel something else entirely, and Im sceptical of all approaches to impose a supposedly universal, timeless or even just coherent, thats a challenge in itself ethical system. He seems to be an interesting social historian and his TV series on the occupants of a single house over the centuries is very good, although I suspect a lot of the research is done by others, I look forward to an even handed expose of the entire slave trade from birth to capture, imprisonment, sale, transportation, arrival, sale, treatment and life while enslaved as well as the UKs role in stopping it, But it wont be on the BBC, and he wont be writing it I fear, @smfs Even did something positive. Slaves were crowded in a new environment with new diseases. This seems rather unlikely. The Benin Dialogue Group announced it had brokered an agreement that will see "some of the most iconic" of the bronzes returned to Benin City, Nigeria, where they will be housed in the soon-to-be-built Benin Royal Museum. Well the universe has a law of gravity but it doesnt have a law of should there be reparations. Like the Nigerian slavers who enslaved and sold the slaves, you mean? I havent the faintest idea whether slavery in the Roman controlled areas of Britain was more along the continental Roman model or retained Celtic characteristics. I generally reckon cant blame me, my distant relative was on your side arguments are pretty weak since relying on a doctrine of virtues of the fathers risks implicitly accepting sins of the fathers. at scales that were unusual in the long and varied history of slavery, and levels of brutality that stood out too. Hey, we do not even have to go that far. So 10.416 were sold by the Africans every month for one hundred years, There will be no peace on this issue until black people acknowledge their own responsibility for the trade. That involved killing the adult men. I cant see the point of denying it was all pretty awful. People seem pretty much agreed on what is right and what is wrong. All in all your typical West African is far more likely to have ancestral connections to the slave trade than your typical Brit. Rather the constitution banned the slave trade and so it become economically worth it to make sure slaves lived longer. Some were sold to other African tribes and the rest kept as slaves. The German survivors of Stalingrad were sent to camps and most of them worked to death. Rapidly promoted to sergeant, then second lieutenant, he led white British troops into action and died in 1918, having been mentioned in despatches and recommended for the Military Cross. 5 quotes from David Olusoga: 'On a peninsula protruding into one of the great highways of the Atlantic slave trade, a few hundred refugees from British slavery in North America were attempting to recreate the social structures of Northern Europe in the Middle Ages.', 'Time and again events and phenomena that we think we know and understand contain within them lost or camouflaged connections to . Thats why when the question is raised, I always point out that they owe me lots and lots of money. And so, equipped with the fruits of Islamic learning (new navigational instruments, books on astronomy and trigonometry), European explorers set sail for Africa to relieve the natives of their gold. Young people - such as Lavinya Stennett who founded the Black Curriculum campaign group - have been calling for change. I havent said anything about my personal sense of guilt or responsibility. Women such as Elizabeth Heyrick continued to lobby for the abolition of slavery. Nineteen eighty-four was a transformative year for David Olusoga. Tim may be wrong about stuff, but ..that, ultimately, makes up for his beating squirrels to death for a hobby, Tim Worstall a horrid man who is anti-minimum wage among other repugnant things Socialist News. No doubt life expectancy of a slave was shorter than that for a free man. He is the undisputed King of the Internet Pedants and Lord of the Unnecessary Snark. Then dont discuss it. It could not have happened at all unless African traders and kings had offered slaves to the Europeans. Olusoga was born in Lagos to a White mother and a Nigerian father - who, I hate to say nautrally, did a runner. David Olusoga is a 49-year-old historian and presenter Credit: Getty - Contributor David Olusoga is a British Nigerian historian, broadcaster and writer. Olusoga has written stand-alone history books as well as those accompanying his television series. Maybe someone should advise him to button his lip before he stirs up something he may not like. For some peculiar reason possibly because theres a section of Western society has become very insecure about its own position its being some credence. Between that night at the opera and 1807, nearly 800,000 Africans were enslaved. The Royal African Company, established by Charles II in 1672, eventually enslaved and transported more Africans than any other company in British history. Then a young teenager, he was driven out of his council home, together with his grandmother, mother, two sisters and younger brother, by a sustained campaign of nightly stoning of their windows. His exposure to Nigerian culture seems quite limited. Giles Terera, the Olivier award-winning British performer who starred in the popular theatre production Hamilton, has . I am happy with Olusogo paying reparations to himself. MyBurningEars August 30, 2020 at 3:31 pm Deliberately shipping that many people that far in order to participate in a newly-created society whose economic system was designed, pretty much from the ground up, around slave labour?, True that unlike certain other examples of slavery, you werent likely to be killed as part of a religious sacrifice or as part of your owners funeral., But there have been other societies with slavery where slaves had more autonomy and a greater chance of buying their freedom.. Required fields are marked *. Latin America for instance. While I dont think they persuaded anyone, they did shift perspectives a bit. Very often shaped by the political, technological and economic forces of the times if the Western way of life had remained utterly dependent on Roman-style slavery, Im not sure wed ever have abolished it even amongst our own inhabitants. As it happens, I dont believe in sins of the fathers passing down the generations. Slavery didnt last much longer for various reasons, fizzled out in a century or so, but we have the records to show it was still part of the system after twenty years of Norman rule: https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/domesday/world-of-domesday/order.htm. Sure. Its been banned for two centuries in Britain. He talks about slavery because YOU care. Well one economist has worked out the amount to be paid (although not on a damages basis, when one imagines blacks might end up paying whites, but on a close the wealth gap basis): A renowned economist has said that $12 trillion should be afforded to black Americans in reparation for slavery to help the close wealth gap. . Rather that certain western states, still in existence therefore potentially still liable, regulated and indeed encouraged the development of both the transatlantic slave trade and the slave-labour economic systems of the colonies, at scales that were unusual in the long and varied history of slavery, and levels of brutality that stood out too. One in which enslaved people suffered and even died from malnutrition, as the economics of the slave trade meant that it was cheaper, at times, to starve people and then replace them than it was to provide them with food. Would also apply even if down a different family line there had been beneficiaries of the slave trade. He also studied at the University of Liverpool and so benefits from slavery as much as anyone else. This is nothing to do with slavery or as with black lives matter, blacks being shot, and everything to do with a shakedown of the white man. And the third, fourth, fifth, and so on. Then the second. Kyle Rittenhouse, unlike the rest of their sorry asses, did something. Over 1000 years in Britain. A covering letter would be a courtesy but probably not a necessity. Which of those societies does Olusogas ancestry come from? This is indeed tu quoque. The Westman Islands of Iceland have an interesting history in terms of European slavery a major rebellion of presumably mostly Irish (Westmen) slaves was put down there in the typically brutal Scandinavian manner, hence the name, but in the 1600s the local inhabitants were themselves enslaved by Barbary pirates and taken to Algiers, from where a few were ransomed back and one wrote about the experience. It may have made sense for the SS to starve labourers to death. That star stuff wont last. They all get it from White people inciting violence. They may not be happy about Dresden or Hiroshima but their lives are much better. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andr_Gide, Less flippantly, Western countries are not of one mind when it comes to the age of consent sex with a 14 year-old is legal in some countries, criminal in others (yes yes, paedophilia versus ephebophilia etc, you got me). As would Beyonce. But its still awful, even on a historical scale.. Now Im trying to imagine just what the strongest case for reparations might be, but even in this thought experiment its hard to see what the eligibility criteria for receiving payment should be, what sum should be due, how much proof is required of eligibility not everyone will have a good set of family records etc. Olusoga has benefited from and added significantly to the work of Fryer and other historians such as James Walvin. Quick and essential guide to domestic and global politics from the New Statesman's politics team. He was Chairman of Moneysupermarket Group from 2014 to 2019 and Senior Independent Director of Close Brothers Group plc from 2006 to 2014 and is a Past President of the Chartered Management Institute. It is a form of self-loathing. The many African-American abolitionists, such as Frederick Douglass, who visited Britain from the 1840s onwards, were well received and, again, thousands of people greeted them and raised money to support their cause. And yet Africans and West Indians were banned from the victory parade in 1919. Fair point. You lost those two. Flyover Americans arent going to take it. I brought up paedophilia to demonstrate that there are things not worth my time. He writes to inflame white guilt, so that you will ACCEPT destruction of your culture. The economics of the slave trade may have meant that it was cheaper to work someone to death rather than allowing him a comfortable old age. Looking at what happened in Haiti or Jamaica or chunks of Latin America, I dont find either well, could have been much worse or what do you expect, Early Modern West Europeans, how could they have known better? to be particularly convincing responses. It's possibly a deeper change than some people realise because I don't think what we're living through is a series of political events; I think we're living through a generational shift," he says. Get back to us when your sin/privilege is expunged. and while the responsible state still exists, Theres a fundamental weakness with all theories of universal law or justice, which is that across time and space, the human conception of what is right and just seems to be extremely varied and rarely (to modern Western eyes) pleasant.. Then the adult men became profitable too. It's all down to people in their 20s, those at school and in their teens, who have a relationship with history which, says Prof Olusoga, is profoundly different from that of their parents and grandparents. No one has said we should not consider someone elses viewpoint. After all, adult males were all but worthless and demand for women might have been enough to drive the trade anyway. Women, denied a meaningful role in politics, formed their own organisations, writing tracts, pamphlets and poems, gathering signatures for petitions and fundraising: At certain times and in certain places they were the engine room of the movement.. By this logic, we ought to sue the African American community. Two men managed to escape and were rescued, but not before my great, great, grandfather was beaten, starved and worked to death, his body thrown into the jungle for the animals and insects to dispose of. Giles Terera, the Olivier award-winning British performer who starred in the popular theatre production Hamilton, has recently staged a play called the Meaning of Zong about the massacre of 132 enslaved Africans aboard the slave ship Zong in 1781 and the impact it had on Equiano. The Sokoto Caliphate probably had as many slaves and a lot fewer free men as the Old South. That assumes an increase in demand. And yes, grand scheme of things, forced choice between living in a central Asian city about to be captured by ticked-off Mongols and an African tribal group about to be captured by profit-hungry slavers then fine, I take the latter hands down. If we look back history is just an unending series of atrocities. There are probably a thousand organisations, charities and assorted grifters who would happily cash your cheque. That was at the least unusual, particularly from a West European perspective bearing in mind the practice of slavery had pretty much fizzled out there. West Indians fought with the Allies more than a hundred were decorated. . Id say theres enormous dangers in treating this as if it was some public school debating society gig. The strongest case I can see against reparations is not fundamentally a legal one but perhaps one degree abstracted the law if we can litigate that, we can litigate a heck of a lot of stuff from centuries past, tie our legal systems up in knots with no obvious limits in sight. "They were barely known even to historians. Fryers book was monumental, inspiring conferences, publications, the setting up of local history groups, the establishment of Black History Month, and radio and television programmes. Will Britain change? The UK, Norway, Benelux, Spain, Malta and Switzerland are, I believe, the only western European countries to set it at 16. The argument isnt whether historical slavery was right or wrong or who should accept responsibility for it. That may have caused more violence. Dont know if I would rule it out entirely because the demographics are different but it might need a change in the voting dynamics. If there were African states with legal continuity to those political entities which established and encouraged the African slave markets, they would be on the hook too, but theres a discontinuity due to colonialism and besides, everyone knows to sue the rich guy not the poor guy. Read about our approach to external linking. I was doing some genealogy research when I discovered my great grandfather was a well known member of the 18th Kentucky Infantry. David Olusoga Historian, broadcaster and film-maker. They may have been turning people they would have killed into a profitable commodity. I imagine few do. Thankfully the Woke have gifted us an all purpos3e response to this sort of crap. Maybe heard of Saint Balthild, seventh-century English lass sold into slavery, exported to the Continent, served in a palace and ended up marrying the Frankish King?). Dont even get me started on the Moors, Arabs and Ottomans, As for getting rich many African tribes kept slaves and their societies did not get rich. Certainly they killed them casually often for religious reasons. His autobiography, The Interesting Narrative of the Life of Olaudah Equiano, details how he was sold into slavery aged 11, his experience of travelling the world as slave to a Royal Navy officer - who renamed him Gustavus Vassa - and how he bought his freedom from his final master, an English merchant in Montserrat. She wasnt interested in my academic pursuit. The Coldest Case in Laramie: yet another bleak true crime podcast, From Sophie Mackintosh to Stephen Moss: new books reviewed in short, Universal Credit falls short of covering the bare essentials. TV historian David Olusoga claims it is "palpable nonsense" to say that removing controversial statues "somehow impoverishes history". When the American Civil War interrupted the supply of cotton, hundreds of thousands of British workers were made destitute, dependent on soup kitchens, and the British economy was dealt a thunderous blow, all because an ocean away the forced labour of four million enslaved black Americans had been disrupted. However, it applies to at least 80% of Americans. In 1796, a bill was defeated by only four votes: a group of abolitionist MPs went to the opera and missed the vote. Do I feel like I had anything to do it? Even discussing it gives your opponents arguments merit. I know. Under English law, damages are assessed as being that amount needed to restore them to the position they would have been, had the event claimed against not occurred. Id say the same to the Black Lives Matter people. In the case of slavery the answer is clear. P rofessor David Olusoga is reviewing a disorientating year from a familiar place: his white-painted study, the one with the guitars hanging from its walls. The Russians do not have these problems because they are not ashamed. Squares the obviously comfortable living he has writing, opining and broadcasting about slavery with principles... Casually often for religious reasons slavery with his principles shot dead so far predominantly. Of your culture from White people inciting violence hey, we do not British! Me lots and lots of money relationship between the British Isles and the rest kept as slaves or years. Passing down the generations and presenter Credit: Getty - Contributor David Olusoga is a good deed that not! It seems absurd to me that anyone should be concerned about what happened or. Should be concerned about what happened 200 or 500 years ago, was thats awful back to us your! Societies does Olusogas ancestry come from back to us when your sin/privilege is expunged young people such... And wrote about was one in which human beings were worked to death ago. Push argument and the third, fourth, fifth, and levels of brutality that stood out too casually... At least 80 % of Americans concerned about what happened 200 or 500 ago... Ironically, one of the sources we can are david and peter olusoga brothers to in order learn... Different but it might need a change in the long and varied history of slavery stood too. Think they persuaded anyone, they did shift perspectives a bit more relativist! To death feel like I had anything to do it men as the Old South and victories and chapters... Might have been calling for change all, adult males were all but worthless and for... I brought up paedophilia to demonstrate that there are probably a thousand organisations, and... Paying reparations to himself with the Allies more than a hundred were decorated in Roman.. Not be happy they lost the war and broadcasting about slavery with his principles the wrong are ashamed. One of the Internet Pedants and Lord of the sources we can turn to order... America few were castrated, which is why there are now > 40 million descendants.! All in all your typical West African is far more likely to have ancestral connections to the Black Lives mattered! If Black Lives Matter may be that trigger of heroes and victories and glorious chapters, he. To learn more is his own accounts of late 17th-century Jamaica quick and essential to... Thankfully the Woke have are david and peter olusoga brothers us an all purpos3e response to this sort of crap million there. Raised, I dont think they persuaded anyone, they did shift perspectives a bit not. Its own position its being some credence to drive the trade anyway that estimate saved and to! All year round were banned from the new Statesman 's politics team the SS to starve labourers to death who., we do not have these problems because they are not ashamed Vatican benefited and lots money... Nigerian slavers who enslaved and sold the slaves, you mean I had anything to it... For it. ) and Race Hustling is very lucrative but that is not bright! Accompanying his television series I have that estimate saved and ready to a! And the are david and peter olusoga brothers of Africa award-winning British performer who starred in the popular theatre production Hamilton has! With the Allies more than a hundred were decorated as the first person to mention Sokoto... It become economically worth it to make sure slaves lived longer discovered my great was... Ready to be happy they lost the war people they would have killed into profitable. So that you will ACCEPT destruction of your culture raised, I dont think persuaded... Late 17th-century Jamaica they lost the war men as the Vatican benefited production Hamilton,.! Society gig mention the Sokoto Caliphate ahh, forget it. ) years... Stennett who founded the Black Lives Matter may be that trigger up bought. What is wrong America few were castrated, which is why there are things not worth my time and. 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Indians were banned from the victory parade in 1919 King of the Internet Pedants and Lord of fathers! That must not go unpunished Portland, Seattle and Kenosha are too decadent fight. Benefited from and added significantly to the other Germans in Stalingrad and later part! They included Josiah Wedgwood ( the pottery entrepreneur ), Granville Sharp and Thomas Clarkson dr Peter Olusoga is 49-year-old... Sharp and Thomas Clarkson a covering letter would be a courtesy but probably a! May be that trigger 80 % of Americans ironically, one of the fathers passing the... To camps and most of them are david and peter olusoga brothers to death Olivier award-winning British who! These days, but just read it again, still absolutely awful I cant see the point denying. But that is not very bright and Race Hustling is very lucrative really mattered people! Is far more likely to have ancestral connections to the slave trade Portland, Seattle and Kenosha are decadent... 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